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Post by Burns on Jan 28, 2012 14:02:39 GMT -5
I'm having trouble finding springs for the 35MM Ceriani forks on my bike. The lower section of the tube is reinforced and so .875" o.d. is as big as you can on the spring .
I have a set of Bettor 35mm forks and I have the stock Yamaha forks.
Can I use either the Yam or the Bettor tubes in the Ceriani sliders?
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Post by BubbaLeone on Jan 29, 2012 4:28:47 GMT -5
Burns, I found this flattrack outfit that has a good selection of Ceriani springs: Ceriani Suspension Parts: ForksAnd another shop that has Ceriani springs: 67-77 Forks-Vintage Ceriani 35mmJust throwin' this out there as the smallest springs the first outfit lists are .950" O.D. Are you positive on that .875" O.D? The second shop you'll have to call for info, but I think either one could tell you if the tube swap would work, and which model of Ceriani's you've got.
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Post by grizld1 on Jan 29, 2012 9:00:04 GMT -5
Traxxion Dynamics can have any spring you need wound to your specs at a very decent price. Turnaround is fast and they're fine people to work with.
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Post by Burns on Jan 31, 2012 2:47:48 GMT -5
I'm having some wi-fi issues, but I'm hooked-up now.
The o.d. of the tube is a close estimate. A spark-plug socket with that o.d. will slip through.
Thanks for the hook-up Griz I'll call them tomorrow.
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Post by jetmechmarty on Feb 3, 2012 16:17:04 GMT -5
+1 on Traxxion. You can have new springs, emulators, and tuned for less than a decent pair of shocks.
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Post by Burns on Feb 12, 2012 1:09:48 GMT -5
Traxxion was very prompt and courteous with their reply. These are "one off" odd-ball spec springs so I'm lookinhmat 200 for the set.
I have a virtually new set of progressive springs in the stock '83 forks, so I thought I try to swap the tubes.
My air tool loosened the retaining bolt on the first leg about 3/4 of the way before the rod started spinning with the bolt. So, I fashioned the 17mm (head size) bolt-in-a-socket tool to hold the rod - SURPRISE - these rods don't have the "socket" tops for a bolt tool to fit into. They don't have the bolt tops of the older model forks either.
They have what looks like cut-aways, making what appears to require something like a water-meter wrench to secure them.
Anybody seen anything like that? Any clues on how to secure these rascals.?
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Post by 5twins on Feb 12, 2012 1:27:11 GMT -5
Might they be '77 damper rods? A round top with flats on two sides and a roll pin through the center?  If so, a holding tool can be fashioned out of 1/4" rod hammered flat on the end then jammed in next to the roll pin .....   |
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Post by Burns on Feb 12, 2012 12:24:00 GMT -5
I think that's it 5T's! Looking down the tube I can't see the pin, but the flats look right. Thanks a bunch.
I was going to fashion a tool to hold the flats, holding the pin ooks a whole lot easier.
This front end was on an '83 when I got it but maybe it wasn't born there.
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Post by Burns on Feb 12, 2012 20:08:00 GMT -5
5T's I owe ya. I would have never known that there was a cross bar to jam. A long shaft flat blade screwdriver did the trick for me.
I imaigine your tool would be needed when more torque is required (e.g. the threads are stuck).
I got lucky on the other leg and the air spun the bolt free.
There is a good thread "out there" on rebuilding the forks but it needs your pictures to complete it.
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Post by 5twins on Feb 13, 2012 1:40:06 GMT -5
My little tool doesn't have a tremendous amount of holding power but it's not needed in this case. You're just holding the damper rod against screw removal with the thread sealer on it. The long piece of 1/4" rod I used is actually quite spindly but held good enough to do the job .....  I've since shortened it a bit and put a nice sharp 90° bend on the end. Oh, and I painted it too, lol. Direct me to that fork thread and I'll gladly add some pics and info. I did a bunch of fork work last summer and took lots of measurements, pics, and notes. I assembled myself a "hybrid" set using what I felt were the best stock components - '77 damper rods and tubes, '78-on springs and preload top caps. Damper rods got the Minton mod treatment. |
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Post by Burns on Feb 13, 2012 12:58:04 GMT -5
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Post by 5twins on Feb 13, 2012 18:37:32 GMT -5
Oh, that thread, lol. I already posted the above pics there.
The reason I like the '77 damper rods is I feel they're made to a higher quality standard. The bakelite wiper ring mounts in a separate metal ring that "floats" on the rod. The rod itself is polished more than the newer ones. I would think this should make it pump through it's bushing in the fork tube bottom smoother. The oil holes in the damper rod are beveled. According to an engineer buddy of mine, that increases flow. I feel the tubes are a bit nicer as well. The bushing in the bottom is retained by a snap ring whereas on later tubes, it's simply crimped in place. No doubt, the changes to the '78-on tubes and damper rods were cost cutting measures. I do polish the later damper rods now. I don't know how much it helps but it certainly can't hurt. I'm thinking it may help reduce fork stiction a little.
Of course, emulators and custom straight wound springs are supposed to be best - if you don't mind spending $200. I just wanted to see what could be done for less and with stock components. I had all the stuff laying around so I had at it. The stock springs are still a bit soft so I may need to replace those if some added preload won't fix them. I may try XSLeo's recommendation of straight wound Harley Sportster springs, about $50 a set. Besides the springs, I'm quite happy with how a mildly modded stock set-up works (Minton modded dampers, one ounce more oil that stock).
I have yet to experiment with oil weights. I've just been using the '78-on speced 10wt. The '77 forks speced 20wt. I don't know if this is just because Yamaha got it wrong for the 1st year of these 35mm forks or if they indeed did want it in there because of those beveled damper rod holes. Heavier oil and some preload spacers will be the next things I try in my "hybrid" set.
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Post by preston on Feb 13, 2012 21:56:03 GMT -5
Dear All:
For what validation it is worth,,,
my 77 ride "stock front end" has always been top notch .. compared to the 1971, 72, 74, 75, XS bikes that i had driven (or is that ridden) ... no complaints.
New story;;;
On the other black bike ...the 1975, the forks, are now off,,
I have a set of 1981 forks, I went to do the Minton Mods, and the lower rod already had 4 holes in them, ( I was expecting two holes) they maybe were one size smaller than 1/4", so i drilled them, to 1/4" and cleaned off the edges.
The upper small hole in the rod ( one only) , and I think it was a 1/16" drill bit I used, , to run though that hole, and out the other side. (beveled the edges)
The 75 Bike will retain the stock gauges, with a mount plate I made for the upper 81 tree...
My question, (which maybe you can point me to a better thread, if needed ) ,,,
Has anyone used a 75 style fender , on the 77 and newer forks ?
How did you deal with the mounts of those 2 fender support legs that used to attach to the lower fork?
Looking for suggestions, or photos of what may help me here.
Best to you,, Preston
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Post by 5twins on Feb 14, 2012 2:21:10 GMT -5
Yes, this is where the Minton Mods article gets confusing. He got the number of lower holes and all the stock hole sizes wrong. Instead of 2 lower holes @ 1/4" you'll find 4 @ about 3/16". I did as you did and enlarged the 4 lower holes to near 1/4" (I used a #1 drill bit). For the single upper hole, he tells you to enlarge it slightly with a #54 drill bit. It's already larger than that. On the '77 rods it's about a #45, about a #49 drill size on the '78 and newer rods. All I can figure is that his number got transposed when the article went to print and that he meant a #45 drill bit should be used. That's what I used for the upper hole mods.
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Post by scout4924 on Mar 6, 2012 23:02:21 GMT -5
So after reading this thread and the fork rebuild link I've managed to pull apart one of my 77 forks. (I wedged the roll pin but will make a better tool from a socket now that it can be fitted better) I,ve read the Minton's mods article in the past also. I know little about these bikes. I did finally order a Clymer today. Whats the verdict on the "Minton mods" as it pertains to forks. Is it outdated or are the "mods" worth the effort? Spending a bunch of cash on "the best" components is out for me. I'm putting my 77 Standard back together and need to do the fork seals so I can get it back to a roller. I also have a 78 and 79 Special sitting on my trailer. (just got them both = $100!) So I should take the springs and adjustable preload caps off one of them and use the stock 77 parts having done the minton mods. Up the oil by one ounce? 20w ? Or forget the mods? I'm FORKIN LOST!  |
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