Leakless XS Assembly

[grizld1]

The head studs are in two groups of four. The nuts on the four studs toward the middle of the engine (inner) are seated on steel washers because they don't require an oil seal; they don't run through oil-bearing passages. The nuts on the four studs on the periphery (outer) run through oil-bearing cavities and are seated on rubber-covered washers to provide an oil seal; those are the ones to replace with copper washers.

[Six-Five-O]

The Suzuki part # for the proper copper sealing washers [as originally discussed by Bob Bertaut] is 09168-10017..Retail is $1.79 each...

The rubber clad washers Yamaha used are part #90201-10131-00 and retail for $3.29 each..

Regards

John

[Mathius]

The original post about the copper washers seems to be deleted (or I'm just missing it). The suzuki washers can be used directly as a replacement, or need modified?

Mathius

[Six-Five-O]

Direct replacement according to the world famous Bob Bertaut. Arguably one of the best wrenches to ever turn a bolt on the old XS-650s..

[crazypj22]

Got back from a road trip to Osewego NY, and NH. The only gasket I greased before fitting is leaking (clutch cover) Fitted and filled with oil before I left (just over a week) and its lost about 1 or 2 drips a day.
Well, I tried it and it doesnt work for me. I'll go back to dry fitting all my 'paper' gaskets and just use coppercote on the head gasket (as its copper ;D)
PJ

[acormier7]

Hi,
I'm in Canada and haven't been able to find Coppercote. Anyone have a brand name
I could look for. Any Canadian's know who carry's it.
Thank's,
Art in Peterborough

[grizld1]

It's a Permatex product, Art--Kopper Kote. Comes in two forms, aerosol and brush-on.

[crazypj22]

If you start a newly rebuilt engine without fitting the output shaft (final drive) sprocket to 80lbs/ft, you check all the oil passages in the lower half of the engine, and oil pump operation, the oil leaks out past sprocket oil seal ;D ;D
PJ

[crazypj22]

With a big bore assembly, if you break through into the airway between cylinder and cam chain tunnel, you will get a leak unless you pack entire section with silicon sealer. Tony Hall told me about it a couple of years ago, now I've found out what happens if you don't.
PJ

[tony101bikes]

I've just found out why somebody is selling brass replacements. I've just tried to cut some 4mm copper washers on the lathe - snapped a 10mm drill bit and broke the tip off my parting tool. It's weird stuff when the heat builds up.

Tony

[71XS1B]

Hi Tony,

I've ran into this problem turning copper on my Shoptask 1720XMTC. Some copper alloys have very poor machinability, as they tend to be 'sticky'. Copper expands at the tool and can pinch your drill bit or parting tool. Lubrication, primarily for cooling is very important when machining or turning cooper.

Cheers,
Dan

[tony101bikes]

Thanks Dan

Anybody got use for a 1 inch copper billet with an embedded 10mm drill bit?

Tony

[crazypj22]

Hi Tony,
Cut it a shorter length and use a wood drill at very low speed from reverse end to get broken drill out, the fast spiral helps to clear swarf and wood drills have extra clearnce.
You can grind extra clearance on parting off tool to prevent it sticking but it may be easier to make a fixture to hold outside edge and face o thickness ( or use a small holesaw or panel punch and make out of 1/16" sheet, use steel washer on top o spread load)
PJ

[5twins]

Well, the jury appears to be in. The Athena base gaskets as come in their complete gasket set suck. They push out, leak, and do all manner of bad things. See the thread I started about "Base Gasket Pushing Out" .....

xs650temp.proboards29.com/index.cgi?board=EngineStock&action=display&thread=1181400975

I followed all the tips here - gasket sealer both sides (I used Permatex Super 300, a liquid) and even "staked" it. Upon initial start-up, the base gasket pushed out nearly 1/8" front and rear, and very slightly on the sides. It isn't leaking yet but I wouldn't be surprised if it started to eventually. I'll probably buy a genuine Yamaha one if I need to replace it.

My motor is basically stock, not big bore or high compression, and this gasket couldn't handle it. I'm not the first apparently to have issues with these. Read the thread in the link above and you'll see others have had worst experiences. Wish I knew about this beforehand. I never would have used the darn thing.

[Six-Five-O]

Reposting this in the Leakless Thread, Originally posted by grizld1

Re: Base Gasket Pushing Out
« Reply #12 on Jun 11, 2007, 11:23pm »

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John, what I do is to assemble the cam chain first and put the undressed base gasket in position. I feed the pistons and rings partway into the cylinders, leaving the wristpin holes exposed, drop the cylinders onto the studs, and support 'em on PVC collars that are slit just enough that they can be pulled away when it's time to drop the barrels. With the cylinders supported, I feed the rods into the pistons and install wristpins and clips. Then I dress the base gasket with Permatex Ultra Black, which has a very slow set-up time, lifting the collars one at a time to get under 'em, remove the collars, and lower the barrels. From there the rest of the assembly goes fast; the most time-consuming part left is running a bead of 1104 for the head cover seal. It doesn't hurt to set spacers on the studs after the head is on and run 10 or 15 pounds down on it while you dial in cam timing, if you're degreeing the cam; if you're using a good sealant it won't break the seal when you relieve that pressure to finish assembly, as long as you've established the seal while the pucky's still flexible.

Almost forgot--if the surfaces are in really good shape and the engine's near-stock (no serious compression or displacement increases), I use Permatex Kopper Kote to dress the base gasket. It stays flexible so you don't have to hurry, and it cleans up very easily next time you're in there. Never gave me grief.

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