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Post by magnang on Jul 8, 2010 20:21:17 GMT -5
Found the problem. It wasn't the brushes, but it was the regulator. I did a full continuity check of the brushes and stator against the ground and everything worked out.
Since my wires melted before, I used beefier wire on the live (red) line, ran a patch from the green brush directly to the battery (-) and ditched the inline fuse. Got up to 13.5-14V at moderate revs (no tach ;D). My previous attempts to do the regulator bypass must have bee working, I just had crappy wire that couldn't handle the load.
So next step for me if finding a good regulator. You put me on the right track!
Cheers,
Guy
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Post by prlocal27 on Jul 9, 2010 17:38:59 GMT -5
hey curly, im having a charging issue with my 81 wired to chopper specs. i cannot get the reading to jump past 12.6 ive gone over every connection, and went through your entire list passing all tests aside from 1. i am getting no reading whatsoever on the 3 white wires. according to your guide im led to believe that my stator is bad? wanna get some input before i drop another $200 on a new one.
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Post by bfeltxs on Jul 29, 2010 18:32:11 GMT -5
Why is it that every time I correct something --- I end up with more questions???
In my post #41 I stated I had found my 6 month old battery dead and that everything was good per Curly's tests, except that my rotor only read 4 ohms. The bike was charging at 13.8 so I figured I'd get a rotor later on and just keep the bike on the 'tender' while at home. I also found that the little tin holder on the outer brush was installed incorrectly so I had an immediate 8 volt drop when key was turned on. I guess it never was charging but since it was always on the 'tender' the battery had never run completely dead.
Well, I just went for an hour or two ride and everything worked great. Besides the weight factor, my XS now responds like my KTM 625 SMC. Those round slides really kick a$$.
Once home I thought I'd check the battery voltage...just for giggles. 13.45 HMMM. Turned the key back on ... 12.75 (bike only has head and tailight to draw power). Started the bike and have 14.75 reading charging the battery. Did my rotor fix itself??? Guess I 'd better pull the side cover and check that rotor reading again. Wouldn't you know I ordered another rotor this morning. Oh well, from what I've read on this website, I'll need one sooner or later.
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wrencher
New Member
81 xs650sh sn 4m4
Posts: 4
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Post by wrencher on Aug 24, 2010 21:02:05 GMT -5
hi everyone! i have an 81 xs650 my first bike so bare wtih me. i suddenly have a charge issue. i've read most all related post but still having trouble. i'm confussed as to what connectors to plug and unplug. i have a 6 pin plug 3 white a green and a red an a blue with the yellow wire. next to a 3 pin plug what is the 3 pin plug for ? well any way what is the pos brush? with everything connected both my brushes have volts...batt volts rt one .75volts less left on lf one is grenn and rt is red/brown? pass curly's step 1 step 2 no slap step 3 apply power to green wire no change at batt is this step correct? step 4 i get lost here if you have batt volts at brush is this still nessary? if so where is the brown black wire ? in the 3 pin one?
step 4 .6 ohm and inf both rings. step 6 nearly zero using an auto fluke meter step 7 at first no ac volt with or with out yellow wire step 7 at first it was nearly zero then had .7ohm all pins and inf to batt ground all pins (3 pin connector still connected all test).any thank you for any info The Wrencher
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wrencher
New Member
81 xs650sh sn 4m4
Posts: 4
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Post by wrencher on Aug 24, 2010 21:04:49 GMT -5
oh yes suddenly my headlight stopped coming on after start up i saw something about the 2 being related save for one thing if i put momentary power to yellow wire it comes on weather or not the applied power stays or not
thanks The Wrencher
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wrencher
New Member
81 xs650sh sn 4m4
Posts: 4
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Post by wrencher on Aug 28, 2010 16:51:24 GMT -5
ok i mis read the directions and found had to ground the green wire...rookie lol... anyway it charges past 16 v now when grounded i checked all the grounds and they are good suspect reg... also head light works properly once i get some volts generated when grounding wire
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Post by ShakerNorm on Aug 28, 2010 23:45:04 GMT -5
Wrencher - it's always in the details....especially with wiring....
BTW - your 4M4 is an 1981 XS650SH. Serial numbers start with 4M4-000101, and painted in New Yamaha Black or Frost Silver
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Post by thecopperkid on Sept 15, 2010 23:18:44 GMT -5
Hi guys, I've got an '83 on my hands here with a stock wiring setup. I ran down Curly's guide and came across a problem at step 4 which I'm hoping you guys can help me with. I have full battery voltage at the keyswitch on both the red and brown wires, and the brown wire at the brushes has full battery voltage, but this is ONLY when the regulator is unplugged. With the regulator plugged in, I loose a full volt when I test the voltage at the brush. My question is if this indicates a short somewhere after the regulator? Could plugging in the regulator complete a short circuit with this faulty wire hidden somewhere in the rest of the wiring harness?  Any help you can give me would be appreciated, this bike is mint other than the charging not working, it's driving me crazy having it stuck in my garage. Thanks in advance, The Copper Kid |
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Post by pamcopete on Sept 16, 2010 5:31:37 GMT -5
thecopperkid,
1. Could be an indication of a shorted or low resistance rotor. Remove the brushes and measure the resistance from one slip ring to the other. Should be 5 Ohms.
2. The battery voltage will drop slightly when you plug in the regulator because that causes current to flow through the rotor. A 1 volt drop would not be unusual.
3. The fuse holders on that model are notoriously bad with high resistance on the fuse contacts. Measure your battery voltage and compare to the voltage on the brush to see if the drop is occurring across the fuse. Replace the crap stock fuse holders.
4. I presume that your battery voltage is low due to the lack of a working charging system. That means that the open circuit voltage will be higher than it is with a load applied, such as the rotor current when you plug in the regulator.
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Post by thecopperkid on Sept 16, 2010 22:49:30 GMT -5
Thanks for getting back to me so fast! I'll check all of these things, hopefully it is one of them.
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Post by jeffnfranklintn on Apr 26, 2011 0:20:30 GMT -5
Continued from a previous post in "Introductions".....I have read Curley's guide to testing the componets in the charging system...If I have done it correctly everything checks to be okay....except the voltage being supplied to the rotor it's way too low. Am I checking the right part? It has a new reg/rec...a new stator....new brushes and a new rotor. On this stator there is "pick up coil" looking thing located at the 4 o'clock position. Is this where the brushes are located? I have checked voltage and continuity every way I can think of...(not that I'm an expert) I must be missing something or not understanding Curley's instructions. I'm at the point where I think there is not enough voltage being supplied to the rotor so that the system can properly charge the battery. Are there any pics posted on this site that shows what and where everything is on these charging systems? Thanks for any input.
Jeff
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Post by ShakerNorm on Apr 27, 2011 0:50:14 GMT -5
The Pick-up coil will be the sensor that triggers the electronic ignition system for the engine. If the coil and brushes check out - then check your battery - get it load tested at your nearest auto store (most will do it for free). These things HATE having a battery that's not in perfect working order.... If it's not fully charged, the charging system has very little power to re-charge it with. And with low voltage - it won't be able to "kick-start" itself and put out full power. It needs close to 12 volts to get the alternator started.
The charging system on these is pretty weak - about 15 amps total, and someone here (quite a while ago) added up all the lighting, and came up with around 14 amps of lighting alone. Add that to the ignition system, and there's not much left to charge your battery if it discharges.
Personally - I set mine up with PamcoPete's electronic Voltage Regulator (since mine originally had a mechanical VR, which was a bear to properly adjust - your friend's bike will already have an electronic VR), and converted all my lights (except my headlight) to LED's to save power. I'm also now trying to convert my headlight to an HID setup to save a little power there, too - and still get more light so I can ride at night.
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Post by jeffnfranklintn on Apr 27, 2011 1:10:19 GMT -5
The Pick-up coil will be the sensor that triggers the electronic ignition system for the engine. If the coil and brushes check out - then check your battery - get it load tested at your nearest auto store (most will do it for free). These things HATE having a battery that's not in perfect working order.... If it's not fully charged, the charging system has very little power to re-charge it with. And with low voltage - it won't be able to "kick-start" itself and put out full power. It needs close to 12 volts to get the alternator started. The charging system on these is pretty weak - about 15 amps total, and someone here (quite a while ago) added up all the lighting, and came up with around 14 amps of lighting alone. Add that to the ignition system, and there's not much left to charge your battery if it discharges. Personally - I set mine up with PamcoPete's electronic Voltage Regulator (since mine originally had a mechanical VR, which was a bear to properly adjust - your friend's bike will already have an electronic VR), and converted all my lights (except my headlight) to LED's to save power. I'm also now trying to convert my headlight to an HID setup to save a little power there, too - and still get more light so I can ride at night. Thank you...that helps me make more sense of it. Now that I know what that sensor is. I'm going to check the voltage at the brushes again. This is supposedly a brand new battery (the second one she's put in it in two months) but she does ride the bike for 30 mins at a time until the battery is almost completely dead. A good fully charged battery should have how many volts?? Thank you very much for the reply. Jeff |
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Post by ShakerNorm on Apr 27, 2011 1:39:16 GMT -5
A brand new battery will have just over 12 volts, but it shouldn't be burning out a battery that quickly, unless the alternator isn't recharging it at all. And running it till the battery is dead isn't good for the battery, either. Probably best not to ride it until you find the real problem.... Although I have noticed that women do seem to particularly enjoy this bike........
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Post by jeffnfranklintn on May 9, 2011 23:44:54 GMT -5
Update.....haven't been able to look at this bike for several days until this evening. I need to say this again...that everything in the charging system is new. New reg/rec...new stator and brushes...new rotor. Tonight I have been trying to find the voltage loss at the positive side of the brushes and I think I have. I have checked the stator again and it ohms out to be good. Checked voltage supply throughout the charging system and it is getting voltage however....with the reg/rec unplugged I have full battery voltage at the brushes...plug the reg/rec into the connector and the voltage at the brushes drops 2 volts. Is this normal? All these checks were done with the engine not running. Battery is fully charged.
Please help me find this gremlin. ;D
Jeff
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